<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 14 (filtered medium)"><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:Helvetica;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Courier;
panose-1:2 7 4 9 2 2 5 2 4 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Tms Rmn";
panose-1:2 2 6 3 4 5 5 2 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Helv;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 2 2 2 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"New York";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 6 5 6 2 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:System;
panose-1:0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:Wingdings;
panose-1:5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"MS Mincho";
panose-1:2 2 6 9 4 2 5 8 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Batang;
panose-1:2 3 6 0 0 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:SimSun;
panose-1:2 1 6 0 3 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:PMingLiU;
panose-1:2 1 6 1 0 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:"MS Gothic";
panose-1:2 11 6 9 7 2 5 8 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Dotum;
panose-1:2 11 6 0 0 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:SimHei;
panose-1:2 1 6 0 3 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:MingLiU;
panose-1:2 1 6 9 0 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:Mincho;
panose-1:2 2 6 9 4 3 5 8 3 5;}
@font-face
{font-family:Gulim;
panose-1:2 11 6 0 0 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:Century;
panose-1:2 4 6 4 5 5 5 2 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Angsana New";
panose-1:2 2 6 3 5 4 5 2 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Cordia New";
panose-1:2 11 3 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Mangal;
panose-1:0 0 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:Latha;
panose-1:2 0 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:Sylfaen;
panose-1:1 10 5 2 5 3 6 3 3 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:Vrinda;
panose-1:0 0 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:Raavi;
panose-1:2 0 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:Shruti;
panose-1:2 0 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:Sendnya;
panose-1:0 0 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:Gautami;
panose-1:2 0 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:Tunga;
panose-1:0 0 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Estrangelo Edessa";
panose-1:0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Arial Unicode MS";
panose-1:2 11 6 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Cambria;
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Tahoma;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Segoe UI";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:Verdana;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Georgia;
panose-1:2 4 5 2 5 4 5 2 3 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:Garamond;
panose-1:2 2 4 4 3 3 1 1 8 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:Consolas;
panose-1:2 11 6 9 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Trebuchet MS";
panose-1:2 11 6 3 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri-BoldItalic;}
@font-face
{font-family:TeamViewer11;
panose-1:0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:Marlett;
panose-1:0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Arial Black";
panose-1:2 11 10 4 2 1 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bahnschrift Light";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bahnschrift SemiLight";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:Bahnschrift;
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bahnschrift SemiBold";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bahnschrift Light SemiCondensed";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bahnschrift SemiLight SemiConde";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bahnschrift SemiCondensed";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bahnschrift SemiBold SemiConden";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bahnschrift Light Condensed";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bahnschrift SemiLight Condensed";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bahnschrift Condensed";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bahnschrift SemiBold Condensed";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Calibri Light";
panose-1:2 15 3 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Candara;
panose-1:2 14 5 2 3 3 3 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Comic Sans MS";
panose-1:3 15 7 2 3 3 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Constantia;
panose-1:2 3 6 2 5 3 6 3 3 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:Corbel;
panose-1:2 11 5 3 2 2 4 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Ebrima;
panose-1:2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium";
panose-1:2 11 6 3 2 1 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Gabriola;
panose-1:4 4 6 5 5 16 2 2 13 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:Gadugi;
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:Impact;
panose-1:2 11 8 6 3 9 2 5 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Ink Free";
panose-1:3 8 4 2 0 5 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Javanese Text";
panose-1:2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Leelawadee UI";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Leelawadee UI Semilight";
panose-1:2 11 4 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Lucida Console";
panose-1:2 11 6 9 4 5 4 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode";
panose-1:2 11 6 2 3 5 4 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Malgun Gothic";
panose-1:2 11 5 3 2 0 0 2 0 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Malgun Gothic";
panose-1:2 11 5 3 2 0 0 2 0 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Malgun Gothic Semilight";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Malgun Gothic Semilight";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Microsoft Himalaya";
panose-1:1 1 1 0 1 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Microsoft JhengHei";
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Microsoft JhengHei";
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Microsoft JhengHei UI";
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Microsoft JhengHei UI";
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Microsoft JhengHei Light";
panose-1:2 11 3 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Microsoft JhengHei Light";
panose-1:2 11 3 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Microsoft JhengHei UI Light";
panose-1:2 11 3 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Microsoft JhengHei UI Light";
panose-1:2 11 3 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Microsoft New Tai Lue";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Microsoft PhagsPa";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Microsoft Sans Serif";
panose-1:2 11 6 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Microsoft Tai Le";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Microsoft YaHei";
panose-1:2 11 5 3 2 2 4 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Microsoft YaHei";
panose-1:2 11 5 3 2 2 4 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Microsoft YaHei UI";
panose-1:2 11 5 3 2 2 4 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Microsoft YaHei UI";
panose-1:2 11 5 3 2 2 4 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Microsoft YaHei Light";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Microsoft YaHei Light";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Microsoft YaHei UI Light";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Microsoft YaHei UI Light";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Microsoft Yi Baiti";
panose-1:3 0 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:MingLiU-ExtB;
panose-1:2 2 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@MingLiU-ExtB";
panose-1:2 2 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:PMingLiU-ExtB;
panose-1:2 2 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@PMingLiU-ExtB";
panose-1:2 2 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:MingLiU_HKSCS-ExtB;
panose-1:2 2 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@MingLiU_HKSCS-ExtB";
panose-1:2 2 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Mongolian Baiti";
panose-1:3 0 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@MS Gothic";
panose-1:2 11 6 9 7 2 5 8 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"MS UI Gothic";
panose-1:2 11 6 0 7 2 5 8 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@MS UI Gothic";
panose-1:2 11 6 0 7 2 5 8 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"MS PGothic";
panose-1:2 11 6 0 7 2 5 8 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@MS PGothic";
panose-1:2 11 6 0 7 2 5 8 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"MV Boli";
panose-1:2 0 5 0 3 2 0 9 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Myanmar Text";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Nirmala UI";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Nirmala UI Semilight";
panose-1:2 11 4 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Palatino Linotype";
panose-1:2 4 5 2 5 5 5 3 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Segoe MDL2 Assets";
panose-1:5 10 1 2 1 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Segoe Print";
panose-1:2 0 6 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Segoe Script";
panose-1:2 11 5 4 2 0 0 0 0 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Segoe UI Black";
panose-1:2 11 10 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Segoe UI Emoji";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Segoe UI Historic";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Segoe UI Light";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Segoe UI Semibold";
panose-1:2 11 7 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Segoe UI Semilight";
panose-1:2 11 4 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Segoe UI Symbol";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 4 2 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@SimSun";
panose-1:2 1 6 0 3 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:NSimSun;
panose-1:2 1 6 9 3 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@NSimSun";
panose-1:2 1 6 9 3 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:SimSun-ExtB;
panose-1:2 1 6 9 6 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@SimSun-ExtB";
panose-1:2 1 6 9 6 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Sitka Small";
panose-1:2 0 5 5 0 0 0 2 0 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Sitka Text";
panose-1:2 0 5 5 0 0 0 2 0 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Sitka Subheading";
panose-1:2 0 5 5 0 0 0 2 0 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Sitka Heading";
panose-1:2 0 5 5 0 0 0 2 0 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Sitka Display";
panose-1:2 0 5 5 0 0 0 2 0 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Sitka Banner";
panose-1:2 0 5 5 0 0 0 2 0 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Webdings;
panose-1:5 3 1 2 1 5 9 6 7 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Yu Gothic";
panose-1:2 11 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Yu Gothic";
panose-1:2 11 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Yu Gothic UI";
panose-1:2 11 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Yu Gothic UI";
panose-1:2 11 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Yu Gothic UI Semibold";
panose-1:2 11 7 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Yu Gothic UI Semibold";
panose-1:2 11 7 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Yu Gothic Light";
panose-1:2 11 3 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Yu Gothic Light";
panose-1:2 11 3 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Yu Gothic UI Light";
panose-1:2 11 3 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Yu Gothic UI Light";
panose-1:2 11 3 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Yu Gothic Medium";
panose-1:2 11 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Yu Gothic Medium";
panose-1:2 11 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Yu Gothic UI Semilight";
panose-1:2 11 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Yu Gothic UI Semilight";
panose-1:2 11 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"HoloLens MDL2 Assets";
panose-1:5 10 1 2 1 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:"MT Extra";
panose-1:5 5 1 2 1 2 5 2 2 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Arial Unicode MS";
panose-1:2 11 6 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Wingdings 2";
panose-1:5 2 1 2 1 5 7 7 7 7;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Wingdings 3";
panose-1:5 4 1 2 1 8 7 7 7 7;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Book Antiqua";
panose-1:2 4 6 2 5 3 5 3 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Century Gothic";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Haettenschweiler;
panose-1:2 11 7 6 4 9 2 6 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"MS Outlook";
panose-1:5 1 1 0 1 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Tempus Sans ITC";
panose-1:4 2 4 4 3 13 7 2 2 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:Pristina;
panose-1:3 6 4 2 4 4 6 8 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Papyrus;
panose-1:3 7 5 2 6 5 2 3 2 5;}
@font-face
{font-family:Mistral;
panose-1:3 9 7 2 3 4 7 2 4 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Lucida Handwriting";
panose-1:3 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Kristen ITC";
panose-1:3 5 5 2 4 2 2 3 2 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Juice ITC";
panose-1:4 4 4 3 4 10 2 2 2 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"French Script MT";
panose-1:3 2 4 2 4 6 7 4 6 5;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Freestyle Script";
panose-1:3 8 4 2 3 2 5 11 4 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bradley Hand ITC";
panose-1:3 7 4 2 5 3 2 3 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Arial Narrow";
panose-1:2 11 6 6 2 2 2 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Monotype Corsiva";
panose-1:3 1 1 1 1 2 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:Algerian;
panose-1:4 2 7 5 4 10 2 6 7 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Baskerville Old Face";
panose-1:2 2 6 2 8 5 5 2 3 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bauhaus 93";
panose-1:4 3 9 5 2 11 2 2 12 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bell MT";
panose-1:2 2 5 3 6 3 5 2 3 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Berlin Sans FB";
panose-1:2 14 6 2 2 5 2 2 3 6;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bernard MT Condensed";
panose-1:2 5 8 6 6 9 5 2 4 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bodoni MT Poster Compressed";
panose-1:2 7 7 6 8 6 1 5 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Britannic Bold";
panose-1:2 11 9 3 6 7 3 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Broadway;
panose-1:4 4 9 5 8 11 2 2 5 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Brush Script MT";
panose-1:3 6 8 2 4 4 6 7 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Californian FB";
panose-1:2 7 4 3 6 8 11 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Centaur;
panose-1:2 3 5 4 5 2 5 2 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Chiller;
panose-1:4 2 4 4 3 16 7 2 6 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Colonna MT";
panose-1:4 2 8 5 6 2 2 3 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Cooper Black";
panose-1:2 8 9 4 4 3 11 2 4 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Footlight MT Light";
panose-1:2 4 6 2 6 3 10 2 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Harlow Solid Italic";
panose-1:4 3 6 4 2 15 2 2 13 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:Harrington;
panose-1:4 4 5 5 5 10 2 2 7 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"High Tower Text";
panose-1:2 4 5 2 5 5 6 3 3 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:Jokerman;
panose-1:4 9 6 5 6 13 6 2 7 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Kunstler Script";
panose-1:3 3 4 2 2 6 7 13 13 6;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Lucida Bright";
panose-1:2 4 6 2 5 5 5 2 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Lucida Calligraphy";
panose-1:3 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Lucida Fax";
panose-1:2 6 6 2 5 5 5 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Magneto;
panose-1:4 3 8 5 5 8 2 2 13 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Matura MT Script Capitals";
panose-1:3 2 8 2 6 6 2 7 2 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Modern No\. 20";
panose-1:2 7 7 4 7 5 5 2 3 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Niagara Engraved";
panose-1:4 2 5 2 7 7 3 3 2 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Niagara Solid";
panose-1:4 2 5 2 7 7 2 2 2 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Old English Text MT";
panose-1:3 4 9 2 4 5 8 3 8 6;}
@font-face
{font-family:Onyx;
panose-1:4 5 6 2 8 7 2 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:Parchment;
panose-1:3 4 6 2 4 7 8 4 8 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Playbill;
panose-1:4 5 6 3 10 6 2 2 2 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Poor Richard";
panose-1:2 8 5 2 5 5 5 2 7 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:Ravie;
panose-1:4 4 8 5 5 8 9 2 6 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Informal Roman";
panose-1:3 6 4 2 3 4 6 11 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Showcard Gothic";
panose-1:4 2 9 4 2 1 2 2 6 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Snap ITC";
panose-1:4 4 10 7 6 10 2 2 2 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:Stencil;
panose-1:4 4 9 5 13 8 2 2 4 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Viner Hand ITC";
panose-1:3 7 5 2 3 5 2 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:Vivaldi;
panose-1:3 2 6 2 5 5 6 9 8 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Vladimir Script";
panose-1:3 5 4 2 4 4 7 7 3 5;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Wide Latin";
panose-1:2 10 10 7 5 5 5 2 4 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Tw Cen MT";
panose-1:2 11 6 2 2 1 4 2 6 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Tw Cen MT Condensed";
panose-1:2 11 6 6 2 1 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Script MT Bold";
panose-1:3 4 6 2 4 6 7 8 9 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Rockwell Extra Bold";
panose-1:2 6 9 3 4 5 5 2 4 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Rockwell Condensed";
panose-1:2 6 6 3 5 4 5 2 1 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Rockwell;
panose-1:2 6 6 3 2 2 5 2 4 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Rage Italic";
panose-1:3 7 5 2 4 5 7 7 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Perpetua Titling MT";
panose-1:2 2 5 2 6 5 5 2 8 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Perpetua;
panose-1:2 2 5 2 6 4 1 2 3 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Palace Script MT";
panose-1:3 3 3 2 2 6 7 12 11 5;}
@font-face
{font-family:"OCR A Extended";
panose-1:2 1 5 9 2 1 2 1 3 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Maiandra GD";
panose-1:2 14 5 2 3 3 8 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Lucida Sans Typewriter";
panose-1:2 11 5 9 3 5 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Lucida Sans";
panose-1:2 11 6 2 3 5 4 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Imprint MT Shadow";
panose-1:4 2 6 5 6 3 3 3 2 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Goudy Stout";
panose-1:2 2 9 4 7 3 11 2 4 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Goudy Old Style";
panose-1:2 2 5 2 5 3 5 2 3 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Gloucester MT Extra Condensed";
panose-1:2 3 8 8 2 6 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Gill Sans Ultra Bold Condensed";
panose-1:2 11 10 6 2 1 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Gill Sans Ultra Bold";
panose-1:2 11 10 2 2 1 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Gill Sans MT Condensed";
panose-1:2 11 5 6 2 1 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Gill Sans MT";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 2 1 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Gill Sans MT Ext Condensed Bold";
panose-1:2 11 9 2 2 1 4 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:Gigi;
panose-1:4 4 5 4 6 16 7 2 13 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium Cond";
panose-1:2 11 6 6 3 4 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Franklin Gothic Heavy";
panose-1:2 11 9 3 2 1 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Franklin Gothic Demi Cond";
panose-1:2 11 7 6 3 4 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Franklin Gothic Demi";
panose-1:2 11 7 3 2 1 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book";
panose-1:2 11 5 3 2 1 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Forte;
panose-1:3 6 9 2 4 5 2 7 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Felix Titling";
panose-1:4 6 5 5 6 2 2 2 10 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Eras Medium ITC";
panose-1:2 11 6 2 3 5 4 2 8 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Eras Light ITC";
panose-1:2 11 4 2 3 5 4 2 8 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Eras Demi ITC";
panose-1:2 11 8 5 3 5 4 2 8 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Eras Bold ITC";
panose-1:2 11 9 7 3 5 4 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Engravers MT";
panose-1:2 9 7 7 8 5 5 2 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Elephant;
panose-1:2 2 9 4 9 5 5 2 3 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Edwardian Script ITC";
panose-1:3 3 3 2 4 7 7 13 8 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Curlz MT";
panose-1:4 4 4 4 5 7 2 2 2 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Copperplate Gothic Light";
panose-1:2 14 5 7 2 2 6 2 4 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Copperplate Gothic Bold";
panose-1:2 14 7 5 2 2 6 2 4 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Century Schoolbook";
panose-1:2 4 6 4 5 5 5 2 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Castellar;
panose-1:2 10 4 2 6 4 6 1 3 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Calisto MT";
panose-1:2 4 6 3 5 5 5 3 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bookman Old Style";
panose-1:2 5 6 4 5 5 5 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bodoni MT Condensed";
panose-1:2 7 6 6 8 6 6 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bodoni MT Black";
panose-1:2 7 10 3 8 6 6 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bodoni MT";
panose-1:2 7 6 3 8 6 6 2 2 3;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Blackadder ITC";
panose-1:4 2 5 5 5 16 7 2 13 2;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Arial Rounded MT Bold";
panose-1:2 15 7 4 3 5 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Agency FB";
panose-1:2 11 5 3 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Bookshelf Symbol 7";
panose-1:5 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:"MS Reference Sans Serif";
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"MS Reference Specialty";
panose-1:5 0 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Berlin Sans FB Demi";
panose-1:2 14 8 2 2 5 2 2 3 6;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Tw Cen MT Condensed Extra Bold";
panose-1:2 11 8 3 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Adani Regular";}
@font-face
{font-family:Adani;}
@font-face
{font-family:Avenir-Light;
panose-1:0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:inherit;}
@font-face
{font-family:-webkit-standard;}
@font-face
{font-family:"MS Sans Serif";
panose-1:2 11 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Helvetica Neue";}
@font-face
{font-family:宋体;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@宋体";}
@font-face
{font-family:Frutiger-Light;}
@font-face
{font-family:"HandelGothic BT";}
@font-face
{font-family:Frutiger-Bold;}
@font-face
{font-family:Frutiger-Roman;}
@font-face
{font-family:proxima_nova;}
@font-face
{font-family:BookAntiqua-BoldItalic;
panose-1:0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:DengXian;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Verdana Bold";
panose-1:2 11 8 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Exo;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Frutiger Linotype";}
@font-face
{font-family:o365IconsIE8;}
@font-face
{font-family:o365IconsMouse;}
@font-face
{font-family:Emirates-Bold;}
@font-face
{font-family:Emirates-Medium;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Myriad Pro Light";}
@font-face
{font-family:"Minion Pro";}
@font-face
{font-family:Monospaced;}
@font-face
{font-family:UICTFontTextStyleBody;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@MS Mincho";}
@font-face
{font-family:remialcxesans;
panose-1:0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:Gordita;}
@font-face
{font-family:New;
panose-1:0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Century Gothic \, sans-serif";}
@font-face
{font-family:"Times New Roman \, serif";}
@font-face
{font-family:fdtktid;
panose-1:0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0cm;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:purple;
text-decoration:underline;}
p.MsoAcetate, li.MsoAcetate, div.MsoAcetate
{mso-style-priority:99;
mso-style-link:"Balloon Text Char";
margin:0cm;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:8.0pt;
font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";}
span.EmailStyle17
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D;}
span.EmailStyle18
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D;}
span.BalloonTextChar
{mso-style-name:"Balloon Text Char";
mso-style-priority:99;
mso-style-link:"Balloon Text";
font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";}
span.msoIns
{mso-style-type:export-only;
mso-style-name:"";
text-decoration:underline;
color:teal;}
span.msoDel
{mso-style-type:export-only;
mso-style-name:"";
text-decoration:line-through;
color:red;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-size:10.0pt;}
@page WordSection1
{size:612.0pt 792.0pt;
margin:72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-NZ link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Thanks Sean, Tom et al,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>It certainly is a complex subject. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I think that my original idea is best. I designed my sub to do only 400 ft for safety  but really not to go over about 200 because 400 is where you Techy divers can get to and if all else fails then there is a reasonable chance that a decent rope can be attached and winch it up. Hopefully within 3 days. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>My float rope is good for 2000 lbs so if entangled a decent winch and blowing ballast would hopefully dislodge me.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Mean time I’m going to try and get my head around it all.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>What mechanical brand would be regarded as best? Just for playing with to understand a little of what is going on?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Hugh<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces@psubs.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles<br><b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, 24 April 2019 12:23 AM<br><b>To:</b> personal_submersibles@psubs.org<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] onboard gear<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Sorry Hugh, I just re-read your post and noticed I missed a question. Trimixes are usually referred to by two numbers corresponding to the oxygen percentage and the helium percentage, so 12/65 would be a trimix with 12% oxygen, 65% helium, and balance nitrogen. This notation can also be used to describe nitrox and heliox as well. With nitrox or oxygen, the second number is zero, and with heliox, the two numbers sum to 100%. Heliox and nitrox are also commonly notated with a single number corresponding to the oxygen percentage since the balance gas is implied. Heliox 16 is the same as 16/84, and EAN50 (for Enriched Air Nitrox) is the same as 50/0. 50% oxygen, balance nitrogen.<br><br>END stands for Equivalent Narcotic Depth. An END of 80 fsw means the gas mixture at the specified depth would produce a narcotic effect comparable to breathing air at 80 fsw.<br><br>Sean<br><br><br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 23, 2019, 05:51, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><br>If I were planning a dive to that depth, I'd use 10/70, which has a PPO2 of 1.25 and an END of 80 fsw. For escape, I'd push the PPO2 to closer to the 1.6 maximum, because a higher oxygen content implies a lesser decompression obligation, and I would accept a slightly deeper END, because the nitrogen uptake is slower, so that also reduces the decompression obligation on such a short bounce dive. For escape from 400, I'd suggest 12/65. This gives you a 1.55 PPO2 and an END of 95 fsw, which is still reasonable. The switch to 50/0 can not and must not occur deeper than 70 fsw, and if at all possible, you would want to slow the ascent starting at the switch. Once you break the surface, it will be critical to get on 100% oxygen ASAP, and to evacuate to a recompression facility.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 23:44, Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Thanks Sean.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>What is 50/0 and what is 1.6. PPO2 equate to at 350 – 400 ft. Looking for a simple off the shelf mix for the different depths. Then I can see how critical the depth is to changeover tanks/mixes and then look at the necessary valving. It might be impossible but if it is achievable simply it would help me sleep. Regards, Hugh <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Personal_Submersibles <a href="mailto:[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces@psubs.org]">[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces@psubs.org]</a> <b>On Behalf Of </b>Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, 23 April 2019 4:59 PM<br><b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] onboard gear<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>50/0 would definitely get you to the surface, and avoid the hypoxic zone with a switch at 70 fsw, but its treatment efficacy at atmospheric pressure is negligible. I would want my surface support or emergency response to arrive with 100% oxygen ASAP. In the event of symptomatic DCS, prompt oxygen therapy and prompt transport to a recompression facility can make the difference between temporary discomfort and permanent disability. If I could be assured of rapid access to 100% oxygen once surfaced, then 50/0 as the second gas makes the most sense. If I were escaping without surface support, and would likely have to signal and wait for some time for an evacuation, I'd be more inclined to ride through a brief hypoxic zone in order to have 100% O2 available at the surface for the best shot at survival with a bend. In an escape scenario, the ascent rate negates any decompression advantage of getting on the high PPO2 sooner - you might only get three or four breaths on it as you move up from 70.<br><br>I'd be really concerned about whatever mechanical arrangement facilitates the switch though. Breathing a high PPO2 at depth will kill you, and you must ensure somehow that this is not possible.<br><br>Sean<br><br><br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 22:21, TOM WHENT via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>What about using a EAN50 for the second gas? <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>You can start pulling it at 70 ft which would give more latitude on the minimum operating depth of the first gas. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>At 70ft you can still safely breath a 6% O2 bottom gas which provides a better safety margin. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Just running some numbers for gas quantities...<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>At a depth of 400 fsw, a normal, relaxed diver would consume around 9 CFM.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 12:02 AM -0400, "TOM WHENT via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Very well said Sean. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I do have some thought on your last statement about choosing decompression sickness. I wonder, if DCS would even be a consideration at all in that situation. My reasoning is that prior to escape the sub environment would be at surface pressure of 1 ATA, so there should be no onboarding of inert gas until the equalization and escape occurs. There may not be enough time to absorb enough inert gas into the body tissue to cause DCS. The rate of ascent might be an issue.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The greatest concern, in my opinion would be using a gas which may cause loss of consciousness at or near the surface. There is far less mystery to that and too many have died by breathing their bottom gas too shallow. Recently in my area an experienced rebreather diver died never having exceeded 7ft depth after taking a breath of his hypoxic bottom bailout gas to verify its operation.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 11:41 PM -0400, "TOM WHENT via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Some people have taken air to extreme depths and some have perished doing so. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Sheck Exley's book Caverns Measureless to Man has some excellent examples of this. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The generally accepted maximum oxygen exposure is 1.6 atmospheres of partial pressure. This is generally considered safe for all. Above that it's a crap shoot. Oxygen toxicity is the sole reason air becomes toxic at 218 fsw. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Some people tolerate oxygen toxicity better than others. It is also experienced differently while immersed as opposed to a hyperbaric chamber where tolerance is greater. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>It is also a time- dose relationship. The higher the partial pressure the shorter the exposure duration can be before effects might be experienced. 1.6 ATA of oxygen partial pressure can be sustained for 45 minutes as a single dose. (NOAA oxygen exposure tables ) <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The mechanism of ox tox centers around the formation of oxygen free radicals in the body. The body can naturally eliminate so many before it is overwhelmed and neurological damage occurs. That is my simplified understanding of it. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The higher the oxygen exposure, the more rapidly OFRs are formed and more quickly a person may be affected. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>As divers we stay within the safe known operating parameters and trust that is enough to keep us alive. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Often when there is a fatality the cause of death for the authorities is drowning but usually some other factor caused that outcome. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>In your escape situation, your exposure time might be small enough to avoid disaster. I can't say! I would think that any delay in getting equalized and out of the sub could be increasingly difficult and the stress could predispose to ox tox also. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>If it were me, I would want to set myself up for the greatest possibility of success. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 11:04 PM -0400, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>There have been numerous successful escapes from around 150' depth. And free divers have set records going close to 400' I believe. <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Tom, does the fact that compressed air becomes toxic at 218 ft is solely because of oxygen toxicity?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> Great analysis !<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Brian<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br><br>--- <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a> wrote:<br><br>From: TOM WHENT via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] onboard gear<br>Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2019 20:24:42 -0600 (MDT)<br><br>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>As a rebreather and technical diver and gas blending technician I feel qualified to comment on this. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Heliox 16 would be a poor choice due to expense and O2 content that is borderline at the surface. It would be toxic at 350 ft depth when inspired under ambient pressure and could produce a seizure without warning. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Most deep divers would use a trimix gas of nitrogen , oxygen and helium in varying percentages to sustain life and avoid narcosis. It would have to be tailored specifically for the maximum depth as well as take into consideration your intended purpose of breathing it to the surface. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The trouble is that oxygen becomes toxic when breathed at elevated partial pressures and the first warning of this could be a seizure. Generally these are not survivable when submerged on scuba. Cause of death is inevitably drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Without getting too deep into the gas laws governing this, what this means to you is that for dives of this depth one gas mix is not sufficient. For example a safe oxygen mix at 350ft would contain 13% oxygen or less. The problem arises when ascending to the surface because 13% oxygen will produce unconsciousness there. This is because of the reduced partial pressure from lower ambient pressure which affects the ability to transport oxygen into the body.. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>In the technical diving world we cross this bridge in one of two ways. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>1) using separate cylinders of gas for different phases of the dive... ie travel mix and bottom mix (deco mix also but this would be irrelevant to this discussion)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>2) using a closed circuit rebreather which blends the gas on- the-fly to maintain optimal oxygen partial pressure for the depth. These are very expensive and require far more training than open circuit scuba.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I don't have an easy solution to your problem, but can say that when escaping from that depth, you cannot safely use the same breathing gas without exposing yourself to extreme risk of drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>16 percent oxygen is considered the minimum to sustain life at the surface and can be used safely to a depth of 297 fsw (or 10 atmospheres.)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>An acceptable level of narcosis would be achieved by augmenting this with 57% helium, leaving the balance as nitrogen (27%)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The narcosis benchmark used would be an 80 ft depth equivalent exposure using air. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Realistically 300ft is the deepest you would want to go with one gas, and even that is not ideal. Beyond that all bets are off. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Something else to consider is that in a bailout situation, your ambient breathing air inside the sub could become toxic as pressure inside is increased to equalize to ambient pressure. You would need to be breathing your escape gas at that point. Compressed air becomes toxic at a depth of approximately 218 ft.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I hope this helps! \uD83E\uDD2A<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>If you have any questions of this nature, I'll do my best to help. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Tom<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 8:58 PM -0400, "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>There have been numerous successful escapes from around 150' depth. And free divers have set records going close to 400' I believe. <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Tom, does the fact that compressed air becomes toxic at 218 ft is solely because of oxygen toxicity?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> Great analysis !<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Brian<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br><br>--- <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a> wrote:<br><br>From: TOM WHENT via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] onboard gear<br>Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2019 20:24:42 -0600 (MDT)<br><br>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>As a rebreather and technical diver and gas blending technician I feel qualified to comment on this. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Heliox 16 would be a poor choice due to expense and O2 content that is borderline at the surface. It would be toxic at 350 ft depth when inspired under ambient pressure and could produce a seizure without warning. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Most deep divers would use a trimix gas of nitrogen , oxygen and helium in varying percentages to sustain life and avoid narcosis. It would have to be tailored specifically for the maximum depth as well as take into consideration your intended purpose of breathing it to the surface. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The trouble is that oxygen becomes toxic when breathed at elevated partial pressures and the first warning of this could be a seizure. Generally these are not survivable when submerged on scuba. Cause of death is inevitably drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Without getting too deep into the gas laws governing this, what this means to you is that for dives of this depth one gas mix is not sufficient. For example a safe oxygen mix at 350ft would contain 13% oxygen or less. The problem arises when ascending to the surface because 13% oxygen will produce unconsciousness there. This is because of the reduced partial pressure from lower ambient pressure which affects the ability to transport oxygen into the body.. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>In the technical diving world we cross this bridge in one of two ways. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>1) using separate cylinders of gas for different phases of the dive... ie travel mix and bottom mix (deco mix also but this would be irrelevant to this discussion)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>2) using a closed circuit rebreather which blends the gas on- the-fly to maintain optimal oxygen partial pressure for the depth. These are very expensive and require far more training than open circuit scuba.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I don't have an easy solution to your problem, but can say that when escaping from that depth, you cannot safely use the same breathing gas without exposing yourself to extreme risk of drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>16 percent oxygen is considered the minimum to sustain life at the surface and can be used safely to a depth of 297 fsw (or 10 atmospheres.)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>An acceptable level of narcosis would be achieved by augmenting this with 57% helium, leaving the balance as nitrogen (27%)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The narcosis benchmark used would be an 80 ft depth equivalent exposure using air. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Realistically 300ft is the deepest you would want to go with one gas, and even that is not ideal. Beyond that all bets are off. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Something else to consider is that in a bailout situation, your ambient breathing air inside the sub could become toxic as pressure inside is increased to equalize to ambient pressure. You would need to be breathing your escape gas at that point. Compressed air becomes toxic at a depth of approximately 218 ft.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I hope this helps! \uD83E\uDD2A<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>If you have any questions of this nature, I'll do my best to help. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Tom<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 8:58 PM -0400, "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Some people have taken air to extreme depths and some have perished doing so. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Sheck Exley's book Caverns Measureless to Man has some excellent examples of this. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The generally accepted maximum oxygen exposure is 1.6 atmospheres of partial pressure. This is generally considered safe for all. Above that it's a crap shoot. Oxygen toxicity is the sole reason air becomes toxic at 218 fsw. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Some people tolerate oxygen toxicity better than others. It is also experienced differently while immersed as opposed to a hyperbaric chamber where tolerance is greater. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>It is also a time- dose relationship. The higher the partial pressure the shorter the exposure duration can be before effects might be experienced. 1.6 ATA of oxygen partial pressure can be sustained for 45 minutes as a single dose. (NOAA oxygen exposure tables ) <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The mechanism of ox tox centers around the formation of oxygen free radicals in the body. The body can naturally eliminate so many before it is overwhelmed and neurological damage occurs. That is my simplified understanding of it. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The higher the oxygen exposure, the more rapidly OFRs are formed and more quickly a person may be affected. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>As divers we stay within the safe known operating parameters and trust that is enough to keep us alive. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Often when there is a fatality the cause of death for the authorities is drowning but usually some other factor caused that outcome. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>In your escape situation, your exposure time might be small enough to avoid disaster. I can't say! I would think that any delay in getting equalized and out of the sub could be increasingly difficult and the stress could predispose to ox tox also. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>If it were me, I would want to set myself up for the greatest possibility of success. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 11:04 PM -0400, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>There have been numerous successful escapes from around 150' depth. And free divers have set records going close to 400' I believe. <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Tom, does the fact that compressed air becomes toxic at 218 ft is solely because of oxygen toxicity?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> Great analysis !<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Brian<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br><br>--- personal_submersibles@psubs.org wrote:<br><br>From: TOM WHENT via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] onboard gear<br>Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2019 20:24:42 -0600 (MDT)<br><br>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>As a rebreather and technical diver and gas blending technician I feel qualified to comment on this. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Heliox 16 would be a poor choice due to expense and O2 content that is borderline at the surface. It would be toxic at 350 ft depth when inspired under ambient pressure and could produce a seizure without warning. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Most deep divers would use a trimix gas of nitrogen , oxygen and helium in varying percentages to sustain life and avoid narcosis. It would have to be tailored specifically for the maximum depth as well as take into consideration your intended purpose of breathing it to the surface. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The trouble is that oxygen becomes toxic when breathed at elevated partial pressures and the first warning of this could be a seizure. Generally these are not survivable when submerged on scuba. Cause of death is inevitably drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Without getting too deep into the gas laws governing this, what this means to you is that for dives of this depth one gas mix is not sufficient. For example a safe oxygen mix at 350ft would contain 13% oxygen or less. The problem arises when ascending to the surface because 13% oxygen will produce unconsciousness there. This is because of the reduced partial pressure from lower ambient pressure which affects the ability to transport oxygen into the body.. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>In the technical diving world we cross this bridge in one of two ways. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>1) using separate cylinders of gas for different phases of the dive... ie travel mix and bottom mix (deco mix also but this would be irrelevant to this discussion)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>2) using a closed circuit rebreather which blends the gas on- the-fly to maintain optimal oxygen partial pressure for the depth. These are very expensive and require far more training than open circuit scuba.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I don't have an easy solution to your problem, but can say that when escaping from that depth, you cannot safely use the same breathing gas without exposing yourself to extreme risk of drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>16 percent oxygen is considered the minimum to sustain life at the surface and can be used safely to a depth of 297 fsw (or 10 atmospheres.)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>An acceptable level of narcosis would be achieved by augmenting this with 57% helium, leaving the balance as nitrogen (27%)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The narcosis benchmark used would be an 80 ft depth equivalent exposure using air. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Realistically 300ft is the deepest you would want to go with one gas, and even that is not ideal. Beyond that all bets are off. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Something else to consider is that in a bailout situation, your ambient breathing air inside the sub could become toxic as pressure inside is increased to equalize to ambient pressure. You would need to be breathing your escape gas at that point. Compressed air becomes toxic at a depth of approximately 218 ft.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I hope this helps! \uD83E\uDD2A<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>If you have any questions of this nature, I'll do my best to help. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Tom<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 8:58 PM -0400, "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>There have been numerous successful escapes from around 150' depth. And free divers have set records going close to 400' I believe. <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Tom, does the fact that compressed air becomes toxic at 218 ft is solely because of oxygen toxicity?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> Great analysis !<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Brian<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br><br>--- personal_submersibles@psubs.org wrote:<br><br>From: TOM WHENT via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] onboard gear<br>Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2019 20:24:42 -0600 (MDT)<br><br>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>As a rebreather and technical diver and gas blending technician I feel qualified to comment on this. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Heliox 16 would be a poor choice due to expense and O2 content that is borderline at the surface. It would be toxic at 350 ft depth when inspired under ambient pressure and could produce a seizure without warning. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Most deep divers would use a trimix gas of nitrogen , oxygen and helium in varying percentages to sustain life and avoid narcosis. It would have to be tailored specifically for the maximum depth as well as take into consideration your intended purpose of breathing it to the surface. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The trouble is that oxygen becomes toxic when breathed at elevated partial pressures and the first warning of this could be a seizure. Generally these are not survivable when submerged on scuba. Cause of death is inevitably drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Without getting too deep into the gas laws governing this, what this means to you is that for dives of this depth one gas mix is not sufficient. For example a safe oxygen mix at 350ft would contain 13% oxygen or less. The problem arises when ascending to the surface because 13% oxygen will produce unconsciousness there. This is because of the reduced partial pressure from lower ambient pressure which affects the ability to transport oxygen into the body.. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>In the technical diving world we cross this bridge in one of two ways. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>1) using separate cylinders of gas for different phases of the dive... ie travel mix and bottom mix (deco mix also but this would be irrelevant to this discussion)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>2) using a closed circuit rebreather which blends the gas on- the-fly to maintain optimal oxygen partial pressure for the depth. These are very expensive and require far more training than open circuit scuba.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I don't have an easy solution to your problem, but can say that when escaping from that depth, you cannot safely use the same breathing gas without exposing yourself to extreme risk of drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>16 percent oxygen is considered the minimum to sustain life at the surface and can be used safely to a depth of 297 fsw (or 10 atmospheres.)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>An acceptable level of narcosis would be achieved by augmenting this with 57% helium, leaving the balance as nitrogen (27%)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The narcosis benchmark used would be an 80 ft depth equivalent exposure using air. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Realistically 300ft is the deepest you would want to go with one gas, and even that is not ideal. Beyond that all bets are off. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Something else to consider is that in a bailout situation, your ambient breathing air inside the sub could become toxic as pressure inside is increased to equalize to ambient pressure. You would need to be breathing your escape gas at that point. Compressed air becomes toxic at a depth of approximately 218 ft.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I hope this helps! \uD83E\uDD2A<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>If you have any questions of this nature, I'll do my best to help. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Tom<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 8:58 PM -0400, "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Very well said Sean. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I do have some thought on your last statement about choosing decompression sickness. I wonder, if DCS would even be a consideration at all in that situation. My reasoning is that prior to escape the sub environment would be at surface pressure of 1 ATA, so there should be no onboarding of inert gas until the equalization and escape occurs. There may not be enough time to absorb enough inert gas into the body tissue to cause DCS. The rate of ascent might be an issue.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The greatest concern, in my opinion would be using a gas which may cause loss of consciousness at or near the surface. There is far less mystery to that and too many have died by breathing their bottom gas too shallow. Recently in my area an experienced rebreather diver died never having exceeded 7ft depth after taking a breath of his hypoxic bottom bailout gas to verify its operation.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 11:41 PM -0400, "TOM WHENT via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Some people have taken air to extreme depths and some have perished doing so. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Sheck Exley's book Caverns Measureless to Man has some excellent examples of this. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The generally accepted maximum oxygen exposure is 1.6 atmospheres of partial pressure. This is generally considered safe for all. Above that it's a crap shoot. Oxygen toxicity is the sole reason air becomes toxic at 218 fsw. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Some people tolerate oxygen toxicity better than others. It is also experienced differently while immersed as opposed to a hyperbaric chamber where tolerance is greater. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>It is also a time- dose relationship. The higher the partial pressure the shorter the exposure duration can be before effects might be experienced. 1.6 ATA of oxygen partial pressure can be sustained for 45 minutes as a single dose. (NOAA oxygen exposure tables ) <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The mechanism of ox tox centers around the formation of oxygen free radicals in the body. The body can naturally eliminate so many before it is overwhelmed and neurological damage occurs. That is my simplified understanding of it. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The higher the oxygen exposure, the more rapidly OFRs are formed and more quickly a person may be affected. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>As divers we stay within the safe known operating parameters and trust that is enough to keep us alive. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Often when there is a fatality the cause of death for the authorities is drowning but usually some other factor caused that outcome. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>In your escape situation, your exposure time might be small enough to avoid disaster. I can't say! I would think that any delay in getting equalized and out of the sub could be increasingly difficult and the stress could predispose to ox tox also. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>If it were me, I would want to set myself up for the greatest possibility of success. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 11:04 PM -0400, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>There have been numerous successful escapes from around 150' depth. And free divers have set records going close to 400' I believe. <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Tom, does the fact that compressed air becomes toxic at 218 ft is solely because of oxygen toxicity?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> Great analysis !<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Brian<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br><br>--- personal_submersibles@psubs.org wrote:<br><br>From: TOM WHENT via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] onboard gear<br>Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2019 20:24:42 -0600 (MDT)<br><br>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>As a rebreather and technical diver and gas blending technician I feel qualified to comment on this. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Heliox 16 would be a poor choice due to expense and O2 content that is borderline at the surface. It would be toxic at 350 ft depth when inspired under ambient pressure and could produce a seizure without warning. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Most deep divers would use a trimix gas of nitrogen , oxygen and helium in varying percentages to sustain life and avoid narcosis. It would have to be tailored specifically for the maximum depth as well as take into consideration your intended purpose of breathing it to the surface. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The trouble is that oxygen becomes toxic when breathed at elevated partial pressures and the first warning of this could be a seizure. Generally these are not survivable when submerged on scuba. Cause of death is inevitably drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Without getting too deep into the gas laws governing this, what this means to you is that for dives of this depth one gas mix is not sufficient. For example a safe oxygen mix at 350ft would contain 13% oxygen or less. The problem arises when ascending to the surface because 13% oxygen will produce unconsciousness there. This is because of the reduced partial pressure from lower ambient pressure which affects the ability to transport oxygen into the body.. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>In the technical diving world we cross this bridge in one of two ways. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>1) using separate cylinders of gas for different phases of the dive... ie travel mix and bottom mix (deco mix also but this would be irrelevant to this discussion)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>2) using a closed circuit rebreather which blends the gas on- the-fly to maintain optimal oxygen partial pressure for the depth. These are very expensive and require far more training than open circuit scuba.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I don't have an easy solution to your problem, but can say that when escaping from that depth, you cannot safely use the same breathing gas without exposing yourself to extreme risk of drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>16 percent oxygen is considered the minimum to sustain life at the surface and can be used safely to a depth of 297 fsw (or 10 atmospheres.)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>An acceptable level of narcosis would be achieved by augmenting this with 57% helium, leaving the balance as nitrogen (27%)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The narcosis benchmark used would be an 80 ft depth equivalent exposure using air. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Realistically 300ft is the deepest you would want to go with one gas, and even that is not ideal. Beyond that all bets are off. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Something else to consider is that in a bailout situation, your ambient breathing air inside the sub could become toxic as pressure inside is increased to equalize to ambient pressure. You would need to be breathing your escape gas at that point. Compressed air becomes toxic at a depth of approximately 218 ft.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I hope this helps! \uD83E\uDD2A<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>If you have any questions of this nature, I'll do my best to help. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Tom<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 8:58 PM -0400, "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>There have been numerous successful escapes from around 150' depth. And free divers have set records going close to 400' I believe. <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Tom, does the fact that compressed air becomes toxic at 218 ft is solely because of oxygen toxicity?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> Great analysis !<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Brian<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br><br>--- personal_submersibles@psubs.org wrote:<br><br>From: TOM WHENT via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] onboard gear<br>Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2019 20:24:42 -0600 (MDT)<br><br>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>As a rebreather and technical diver and gas blending technician I feel qualified to comment on this. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Heliox 16 would be a poor choice due to expense and O2 content that is borderline at the surface. It would be toxic at 350 ft depth when inspired under ambient pressure and could produce a seizure without warning. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Most deep divers would use a trimix gas of nitrogen , oxygen and helium in varying percentages to sustain life and avoid narcosis. It would have to be tailored specifically for the maximum depth as well as take into consideration your intended purpose of breathing it to the surface. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The trouble is that oxygen becomes toxic when breathed at elevated partial pressures and the first warning of this could be a seizure. Generally these are not survivable when submerged on scuba. Cause of death is inevitably drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Without getting too deep into the gas laws governing this, what this means to you is that for dives of this depth one gas mix is not sufficient. For example a safe oxygen mix at 350ft would contain 13% oxygen or less. The problem arises when ascending to the surface because 13% oxygen will produce unconsciousness there. This is because of the reduced partial pressure from lower ambient pressure which affects the ability to transport oxygen into the body.. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>In the technical diving world we cross this bridge in one of two ways. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>1) using separate cylinders of gas for different phases of the dive... ie travel mix and bottom mix (deco mix also but this would be irrelevant to this discussion)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>2) using a closed circuit rebreather which blends the gas on- the-fly to maintain optimal oxygen partial pressure for the depth. These are very expensive and require far more training than open circuit scuba.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I don't have an easy solution to your problem, but can say that when escaping from that depth, you cannot safely use the same breathing gas without exposing yourself to extreme risk of drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>16 percent oxygen is considered the minimum to sustain life at the surface and can be used safely to a depth of 297 fsw (or 10 atmospheres.)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>An acceptable level of narcosis would be achieved by augmenting this with 57% helium, leaving the balance as nitrogen (27%)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The narcosis benchmark used would be an 80 ft depth equivalent exposure using air. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Realistically 300ft is the deepest you would want to go with one gas, and even that is not ideal. Beyond that all bets are off. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Something else to consider is that in a bailout situation, your ambient breathing air inside the sub could become toxic as pressure inside is increased to equalize to ambient pressure. You would need to be breathing your escape gas at that point. Compressed air becomes toxic at a depth of approximately 218 ft.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I hope this helps! \uD83E\uDD2A<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>If you have any questions of this nature, I'll do my best to help. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Tom<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 8:58 PM -0400, "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Some people have taken air to extreme depths and some have perished doing so. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Sheck Exley's book Caverns Measureless to Man has some excellent examples of this. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The generally accepted maximum oxygen exposure is 1.6 atmospheres of partial pressure. This is generally considered safe for all. Above that it's a crap shoot. Oxygen toxicity is the sole reason air becomes toxic at 218 fsw. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Some people tolerate oxygen toxicity better than others. It is also experienced differently while immersed as opposed to a hyperbaric chamber where tolerance is greater. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>It is also a time- dose relationship. The higher the partial pressure the shorter the exposure duration can be before effects might be experienced. 1.6 ATA of oxygen partial pressure can be sustained for 45 minutes as a single dose. (NOAA oxygen exposure tables ) <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The mechanism of ox tox centers around the formation of oxygen free radicals in the body. The body can naturally eliminate so many before it is overwhelmed and neurological damage occurs. That is my simplified understanding of it. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The higher the oxygen exposure, the more rapidly OFRs are formed and more quickly a person may be affected. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>As divers we stay within the safe known operating parameters and trust that is enough to keep us alive. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Often when there is a fatality the cause of death for the authorities is drowning but usually some other factor caused that outcome. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>In your escape situation, your exposure time might be small enough to avoid disaster. I can't say! I would think that any delay in getting equalized and out of the sub could be increasingly difficult and the stress could predispose to ox tox also. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>If it were me, I would want to set myself up for the greatest possibility of success. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 11:04 PM -0400, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>There have been numerous successful escapes from around 150' depth. And free divers have set records going close to 400' I believe. <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Tom, does the fact that compressed air becomes toxic at 218 ft is solely because of oxygen toxicity?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> Great analysis !<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Brian<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br><br>--- personal_submersibles@psubs.org wrote:<br><br>From: TOM WHENT via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] onboard gear<br>Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2019 20:24:42 -0600 (MDT)<br><br>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>As a rebreather and technical diver and gas blending technician I feel qualified to comment on this. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Heliox 16 would be a poor choice due to expense and O2 content that is borderline at the surface. It would be toxic at 350 ft depth when inspired under ambient pressure and could produce a seizure without warning. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Most deep divers would use a trimix gas of nitrogen , oxygen and helium in varying percentages to sustain life and avoid narcosis. It would have to be tailored specifically for the maximum depth as well as take into consideration your intended purpose of breathing it to the surface. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The trouble is that oxygen becomes toxic when breathed at elevated partial pressures and the first warning of this could be a seizure. Generally these are not survivable when submerged on scuba. Cause of death is inevitably drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Without getting too deep into the gas laws governing this, what this means to you is that for dives of this depth one gas mix is not sufficient. For example a safe oxygen mix at 350ft would contain 13% oxygen or less. The problem arises when ascending to the surface because 13% oxygen will produce unconsciousness there. This is because of the reduced partial pressure from lower ambient pressure which affects the ability to transport oxygen into the body.. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>In the technical diving world we cross this bridge in one of two ways. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>1) using separate cylinders of gas for different phases of the dive... ie travel mix and bottom mix (deco mix also but this would be irrelevant to this discussion)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>2) using a closed circuit rebreather which blends the gas on- the-fly to maintain optimal oxygen partial pressure for the depth. These are very expensive and require far more training than open circuit scuba.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I don't have an easy solution to your problem, but can say that when escaping from that depth, you cannot safely use the same breathing gas without exposing yourself to extreme risk of drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>16 percent oxygen is considered the minimum to sustain life at the surface and can be used safely to a depth of 297 fsw (or 10 atmospheres.)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>An acceptable level of narcosis would be achieved by augmenting this with 57% helium, leaving the balance as nitrogen (27%)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The narcosis benchmark used would be an 80 ft depth equivalent exposure using air. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Realistically 300ft is the deepest you would want to go with one gas, and even that is not ideal. Beyond that all bets are off. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Something else to consider is that in a bailout situation, your ambient breathing air inside the sub could become toxic as pressure inside is increased to equalize to ambient pressure. You would need to be breathing your escape gas at that point. Compressed air becomes toxic at a depth of approximately 218 ft.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I hope this helps! \uD83E\uDD2A<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>If you have any questions of this nature, I'll do my best to help. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Tom<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 8:58 PM -0400, "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>There have been numerous successful escapes from around 150' depth. And free divers have set records going close to 400' I believe. <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Tom, does the fact that compressed air becomes toxic at 218 ft is solely because of oxygen toxicity?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> Great analysis !<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Brian<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br><br>--- personal_submersibles@psubs.org wrote:<br><br>From: TOM WHENT via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] onboard gear<br>Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2019 20:24:42 -0600 (MDT)<br><br>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>As a rebreather and technical diver and gas blending technician I feel qualified to comment on this. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Heliox 16 would be a poor choice due to expense and O2 content that is borderline at the surface. It would be toxic at 350 ft depth when inspired under ambient pressure and could produce a seizure without warning. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Most deep divers would use a trimix gas of nitrogen , oxygen and helium in varying percentages to sustain life and avoid narcosis. It would have to be tailored specifically for the maximum depth as well as take into consideration your intended purpose of breathing it to the surface. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The trouble is that oxygen becomes toxic when breathed at elevated partial pressures and the first warning of this could be a seizure. Generally these are not survivable when submerged on scuba. Cause of death is inevitably drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Without getting too deep into the gas laws governing this, what this means to you is that for dives of this depth one gas mix is not sufficient. For example a safe oxygen mix at 350ft would contain 13% oxygen or less. The problem arises when ascending to the surface because 13% oxygen will produce unconsciousness there. This is because of the reduced partial pressure from lower ambient pressure which affects the ability to transport oxygen into the body.. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>In the technical diving world we cross this bridge in one of two ways. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>1) using separate cylinders of gas for different phases of the dive... ie travel mix and bottom mix (deco mix also but this would be irrelevant to this discussion)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>2) using a closed circuit rebreather which blends the gas on- the-fly to maintain optimal oxygen partial pressure for the depth. These are very expensive and require far more training than open circuit scuba.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I don't have an easy solution to your problem, but can say that when escaping from that depth, you cannot safely use the same breathing gas without exposing yourself to extreme risk of drowning.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>16 percent oxygen is considered the minimum to sustain life at the surface and can be used safely to a depth of 297 fsw (or 10 atmospheres.)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>An acceptable level of narcosis would be achieved by augmenting this with 57% helium, leaving the balance as nitrogen (27%)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>The narcosis benchmark used would be an 80 ft depth equivalent exposure using air. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Realistically 300ft is the deepest you would want to go with one gas, and even that is not ideal. Beyond that all bets are off. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Something else to consider is that in a bailout situation, your ambient breathing air inside the sub could become toxic as pressure inside is increased to equalize to ambient pressure. You would need to be breathing your escape gas at that point. Compressed air becomes toxic at a depth of approximately 218 ft.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I hope this helps! \uD83E\uDD2A<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>If you have any questions of this nature, I'll do my best to help. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Tom<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 8:58 PM -0400, "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sean,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Yes, I'd rather make it to the surface than die intoxicated in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I think every sub would have to develop their own equations for escaping<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>at varying depths. The k250s & 350s could formulate a best scenario for<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>escape for those classes of submersibles.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in the equation is how fast you'd make it to the surface. A conventional<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>life jacket would crush at a decent depth, the inflatable ones wouldn't<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Inflate much against the water pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>We have previously discussed drogues that are harnessed under your arms<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>and provide air for breathing, but that's only a solution for 1 passenger.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 12:30 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Does that mean that using something like heliox 16 to alleviate the narcosis at the elevated risk of a bends hit is an acceptable compromise? I'd rather be bent at the surface than narced to the extent that I'm unable to leave the bottom.<br><br>Sean<br><br>-------- Original Message --------<br>On Apr 22, 2019, 17:37, Alan via Personal_Submersibles < <a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Also in this equation is the diminishing pressure of the water coming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>through the flood valve because of the compression of the air in the sub.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phil advised to turn on compressed air to hurry the equalisation required<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>to open the hatch, as the water flow in to the sub slows right down toward<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>the end. Also he advised that getting out at over 300ft is near impossible<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>due to nitrogen narcosis leaving you so drunk that you can't get out anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alan<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>On 23/04/2019, at 7:36 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Greg Cottrell once pointed out something that had been non-obvious to me in connection with bailouts from shallow-diving subs like ours - just how big the seacock needs to be to flood the sub quickly enough. Imagine you had a little ball valve of about the diameter of a garden hose. Now lets say you are hung up at 140 feet and need to bail. The ambient pressure is 60 psi, which happens to be the normal pressure for household plumbing. Therefore, your sub would take as long to fill up as it would if you opened the hatch while it was parked on your driveway and stuck the garden hose in. I'm not sure how long that is, and it will depend on the volume of your cabin, but surely it's way past the 10 minute no-decompression time for 140 feet. The bottom line is PSUB seacocks need to be very generously sized because we dive shallow. Shackleton's is 3". <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 2:39 PM Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Depending on the depth that you have to flood the sub and make a free accent to the surface, it really depends on how fast you need to equalize to try and get to the surface before exceeding the nitrogen uptake limits for getting bent on course. Only the air cavity's are affected in a rapid pressurization I believe but my sub has a rated working depth of 350' and as I remember from the old navy tables, you only have about 5 minutes at 165' before you have to make a stop at 10' so due to that fact, I would have to flood the sub as fast as I can to minimize the nitrogen uptake to make it to the surface before getting bent and the negatives to that are that most people can't clear their ears that fast so you are looking at possibly blowing your ear drums which in turn is really painful and screws up you equilibrium which is going to hamper your safe accent to the surface in a timely manner. I am going to have mixed gas in my bailouts to buy me time for getting to the surface and keeping the nitrogen uptake as minimal as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Rick<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:15 AM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Doesn't feel like it compared to Hank! Also, forgetting food, water, blankets and a first aid kit. Forgetting those has been my specialty for my whole life!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Steinke hoods are probably a good idea, although I'm terrified of them myself. Does anyone have any information on what pressure change effects happen physiologically during an emergency escape? I'm a diver so I'm very familiar with what happens when you descend and ascend on scuba, but I'm not sure what happens with a sudden and extreme pressure increase. Other than all your organs getting squished, of course. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Thanks for your input everybody!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 6:58 PM Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi Shanee,<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>That's a pretty comprehensive list you have, and I couldn't fit all that. But how about a pair of Steinke hoods? Oh, and one very simple thing... a flashlight.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Alec<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>On Sun, Apr 21, 2019 at 4:35 PM Shanee Stopnitzky via Personal_Submersibles <<a href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>I'm wondering what everyone's onboard safety/repair kits contain, or what 'loose' gear you carry on dives with you. Ours are (so far): <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>CG requirements</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>air horn<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>whistle<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>life jackets<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire extinguisher<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>safety</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>fire blanket<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x scuba masks<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>2x spare air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>primary gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>backup gas analyzer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare CO2 scrubber - battery powered<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>handheld radios<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>uw radio system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>repair kit</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>gorilla tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>electrical tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>butyl tape<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>zip tie assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare battery terminals<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire connectors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>spare wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>splash zone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>JB weld<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel tie wire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>steel strap<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>e6000 glue <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hose clamp assortment<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>screwdriver set<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>adjustable wrench<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>multi-tool<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>hammer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>scissors<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>What's in your kits?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Shanee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>Institute for Emergence//Community Submersibles Project<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>'The fact remains that political frontiers are impervious to our verbal cultures, while the substantially nonverbal civilization of playfulness crosses them with the happy freedom of the wind and the clouds.' ~ Primo Levi </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif"'>:::::</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'>'Caught up in a mass of abstractions, our attention hypnotized by a host of human-made technologies that only reflect us back to ourselves, it is all too easy for us to forget our carnal inherence in a more-than-human matrix of sensations and sensibilities. Our bodies have formed themselves in delicate reciprocity with the manifold textures, sounds, and shapes of an animate earth. Our eyes have evolved in subtle interaction with other eyes, as our ears are attuned by their very structure to the howling of wolves and the honking of geese. To shut ourselves off from these other voices, to continue by our lifestyles to condemn these other sensibilities to the oblivion of extinction, is to rob our own senses of their integrity, and to rob our minds of their coherence. ' ~David Abrams</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br><a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list <a href="/eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a> <a href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></body></html>