<html><head></head><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3228">Thanks Hank, </div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3228">& Tim, I have a tradition of shopping on the 24th of Dec along<br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3228">with all the other dysfunctional males.</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3228">Alan</div><br> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3234"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3233"> <div dir="ltr" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3232"> <font size="2" face="Arial" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3235"> <hr size="1" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3344"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> <br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Sunday, December 13, 2015 7:37 AM<br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Compensating oil<br> </font> </div> <div class="y_msg_container" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3236"><br><div id="yiv2888311939"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3238"><div style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12px;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3237"><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449945299299_2796"><span>Tim,</span></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449945299299_2796"><span id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449945299299_2858"> my x mas shopping is done, it is sitting in my shop :-) </span></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449945299299_2796"><span id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449945299299_2927">Hank</span></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449945299299_2796"><span><br clear="none"></span></div> <br clear="none"><div class="yiv2888311939qtdSeparateBR" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3346"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div><div class="yiv2888311939yahoo_quoted" style="display:block;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3351"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12px;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3350"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3349"> <div class="qtdSeparateBR"><br><br></div><div class="yiv2888311939yqt7761943679" id="yiv2888311939yqt95074"><div dir="ltr" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3348"><font size="2" face="Arial" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1449957224307_3347"> On Saturday, December 12, 2015 11:16 AM, T Novak via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> wrote:<br clear="none"></font></div> <br clear="none"><br clear="none"> <div class="yiv2888311939y_msg_container"><div id="yiv2888311939"><style>#yiv2888311939 --
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#yiv2888311939 </style><div><div class="yiv2888311939WordSection1"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;">Hank, Alan</span></div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;">My personal favourite way to reverse the thrust is by rotating the motor-prop pod assembly 180 degrees. Doesn't require a sophisticated controller, but it does complicate the mechanical link.</span></div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;">Great link on submersible pumps, Alan. </span></div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;">What are you guys doing on psubs, shouldn't you be out Christmas shopping?</span></div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;">Tim</span></div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;"> </span></div><div class="yiv2888311939yqt9404038149" id="yiv2888311939yqt80768"><div><div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm;"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;"> Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces@psubs.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles<br clear="none"><b>Sent:</b> December-12-15 7:51 AM<br clear="none"><b>To:</b> Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br clear="none"><b>Subject:</b> Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Compensating oil</span></div></div></div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal"> </div><div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449935127885_2940"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;">Alan,</span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449935127885_2940"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;">No clue on brand, there is substantial thrust protection because the motor sits vertical and the weight of the armature is always on the thrust mechanism. If I recall, they have bushings not bearings. If you can add reverse and speed control, you have a winner. I just have no expertise in that area.</span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449935127885_2940"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;">Hank</span></div></div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;"> </span></div><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white;"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div><div><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;">On Saturday, December 12, 2015 8:22 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:</span><span style=""></span></div></div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div><div><div id="yiv2888311939"><div><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">It should be relatively easy to add reverse, but </span></div></div><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">I presume they are either on or off, so you would need the addition of</span></div></div><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">a speed controller anyway. It would be interesting to pull one apart.</span></div></div><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">There might not be much in the way of a thrust bearing, as the pump impeller </span></div></div><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">wouldn't have an axial load on the shaft like a propeller.</span></div></div><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">What brand was it again?</span></div></div><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Alan</span></div></div><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div></div><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""><br clear="none"><br clear="none">Sent from my iPad</span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yqt40931"><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white;"><span style=""><br clear="none">On 13/12/2015, at 2:35 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:</span></div></div><blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;"><div><div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449926923942_2618"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;">Alan,</span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449926923942_2618"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;">I am still in favour of pump motors except I do not know how to reverse them. As far as I can tell they are not reversible. The efficiency in oil comes from the extremely smooth interior of the motor. If you could reverse them, they would be perfect, they are cheap at about 200 dollars for a small 120v and they would be pretty easily modified to take a prop. Oh ya, and they already have thrust bearings. The oil inside was real stinky, kinda like antifreeze.</span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449926923942_2618"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;">Hank</span></div></div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;"> </span></div><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white;"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div><div><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;">On Saturday, December 12, 2015 3:24 AM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:</span><span style=""></span></div></div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div><div><div id="yiv2888311939"><div><div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6619"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Hank, </span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6619"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">what ever happened to your idea of using a submersible pump as a thruster?</span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6619"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Have just been doing a bit of reading on oil compensation of submersible pumps.</span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6613"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">In this article....</span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6613"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.pumped101.com/oilvsair.pdf">http://www.pumped101.com/oilvsair.pdf</a></span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6613"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">it states that with oil compensation there is only a loss of about 1&1/2% efficiency </span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6613"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">over an air compensated motor.....</span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6613"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> "What does reduce an oil filled motor’s efficiency is the energy loss due to oil circulation within the stator housing. </span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6613"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">As a rule of thumb, this circulation requirement reduces efficiency by about 1.5% when compared to an air filled motor. "</span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6613"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> Of interest was that they base this on the use of an oil "Shellflex 210" which has a viscosity of 20.3 cst at 40C.</span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6613"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">I was recently trying to track down a silicone oil of 3cst thinking that I would need a really low viscosity to get reasonable efficiency.</span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6613"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">A chemist I spoke to said at that low a viscosity it would be flammable.</span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6613"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Alan</span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6613"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div></div><div id="yiv2888311939yui_3_16_0_1_1449865396752_6613"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div></div></div></div></div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white;"><span style=""><br clear="none">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><br clear="none"><br clear="none"></span></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div><blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;"><div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a></span></div></div></blockquote></div></div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div><div id="yiv2888311939yqt80157"><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a></span></div></div><div class="yiv2888311939MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><br clear="none"><div class="yiv2888311939yqt9404038149" id="yiv2888311939yqt39557">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><br clear="none"></div><br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div></div> </div> </div> </div></div></div></div><br><div class="yqt7761943679" id="yqt88136">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br clear="none"><a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org" href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles" target="_blank">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><br clear="none"></div><br><br></div> </div> </div></div></body></html>