<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:14pt"><div>Good to hear about the Protruar Emile.</div><div>I enquired about them with the Chinese manufacturer & they offered to send a sample</div><div>for a very reasonable price. But it will be too big for my needs.</div><div>Alan.</div><div>P.S. crazy people everywhere.<img src="http://mail.yimg.com/ok/u/assets/img/emoticons/emo1.gif" alt="*:) happy" style="font-size: 14pt;"></div><div><br></div> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-size: 14pt;"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;"> <div dir="ltr"> <hr size="1"> <font size="2" face="Arial"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> Emile van Essen
<emile@airesearch.nl><br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> 'Personal Submersibles General Discussion' <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> <br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Monday, October 28, 2013 9:33 AM<br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Group Help Request<br> </font> </div> <div class="y_msg_container"><br><div id="yiv8655329949"><style>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy;">The Dutch are crazy ;-)</span></font></div>
<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy;"> </span></font></div>
<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy;">My sub was intensive used
;I spend 50 Hours UW the last 3 months. </span></font></div>
<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy;">The Torque-jet hubless thrusters
proved to be perfect, no compensating, no problem.</span></font></div>
<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy;">The Haswing Protuar at
the stern worked also fine and very efficient. The 2.0 HP brushless motor has a
big slow turning prop .</span></font></div>
<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy;">The gearbox (15:1 !!) is
noisy and it can only be air compensated.</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy;">Regards, Emile</span></font></div>
<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy;">The Netherlands ..</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949yqt2044053721" id="yiv8655329949yqt79179"><div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><b><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma; font-weight: bold;">Van:</span></font></b><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma;"> Personal_Submersibles
[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces@psubs.org] <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Namens </span></b>Alan James<br clear="none">
<b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Verzonden:</span></b> zondag 27 oktober 2013
20:53<br clear="none">
<b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Aan:</span></b> Personal Submersibles General
Discussion<br clear="none">
<b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Onderwerp:</span></b> Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST]
Group Help Request</span></font></div></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv8655329949yqt2044053721" id="yiv8655329949yqt05382"><div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;"> </span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="4" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">Thanks
Alec.</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="4" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">Forget Minn kottas,
this Dutch man is really on to something.</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="4" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZJTGqmtzBs">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZJTGqmtzBs</a></span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="4" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">Alan</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><b><font size="2" color="black" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: black; font-weight: bold;">From:</span></font></b><font size="2" color="black" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: black;"> Private <alecsmyth@gmail.com><br clear="none">
<b><span style="font-weight:bold;">To:</span></b> Personal Submersibles General
Discussion <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> <br clear="none">
<b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Sent:</span></b> Monday, October 28, 2013
8:20 AM<br clear="none">
<b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Group
Help Request</span></font><font color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-family: Helvetica; color: black;"></span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;"> </span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">It
would be fine as long as the total work being done is held constant. In other
words swept area times pitch for the custom prop equals swept area times pitch
for the stock one. That's assuming equal rpm. </span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;"> </span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">Once
you put on the new prop, verify by measuring the amps drawn. If it isn't
drawing more amps it won't be heating up more than with the standard prop.</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">Best,</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">Alec</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;"><br clear="none">
On Oct 27, 2013, at 3:07 PM, Alan James <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:alanlindsayjames@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:alanlindsayjames@yahoo.com">alanlindsayjames@yahoo.com</a>>
wrote:</span></font></div>
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<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;" type="cite">
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<div style="background-color:rgb(255, 255,
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="4" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">I
am wondering whether it is a good idea to change the prop</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="4" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">size on the Minn
Kotta. Or whether it would be good to get advice</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="4" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">from Minn kotta
first. After reading the issues about sub sea motors & overheating</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="4" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">I am a bit wary of
increasing the load, amps & heat in the motor by increasing</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="4" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">the prop size.</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="4" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">With regard to Kort
nozzles.... I found a design on the internet, then tracked down a bucket of
suitable size & slope, fiber glassed around a portion of it, then built up
the thickness of the leading edge.</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="4" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">Alan</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="4" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;"> </span></font></div>
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<div align="center" class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="text-align:center;background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">
</span></font><hr align="center" size="1" width="100%">
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><b><font size="2" color="black" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: black; font-weight: bold;">From:</span></font></b><font size="2" color="black" face="Arial"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: black;"> Private <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:alecsmyth@gmail.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:alecsmyth@gmail.com">alecsmyth@gmail.com</a>><br clear="none">
<b><span style="font-weight:bold;">To:</span></b> Personal Submersibles General
Discussion <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>>
<br clear="none">
<b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Sent:</span></b> Monday, October 28, 2013
7:29 AM<br clear="none">
<b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Group
Help Request</span></font><font color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-family: Helvetica; color: black;"></span></font></div>
</div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;"> </span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">Hi
Joe,</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;"> </span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">Thanks
for doing this. I have a Minnkota 101 here that I can measure for you, but I
also have some suggestions for your consideration.<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Oil or air compensation are both easy and trouble free, so I really don't see
much value-add in the magnetic coupling. Or in a hard case. Ditto reverse, my
trolling motor thrusters with 13 years on them have yet to wear out the reverse
washer, and it's not like I don't use reverse.</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;"> </span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">Where
I do see real room for improvement is with props and nozzles. The stock props
are very short pitched, so if you put several 101s on a small sub for main
propulsion, I suspect you would not get the cruising speed that their combined
horse power would otherwise achieve. In other words, it would be like putting a
big engine in your car but only having first gear.</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;"> </span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">Emile
shared with me that the nice kort on his stern thruster is off a diving
scooter. I researched those briefly and indeed they're in the ballpark of
trolling motor prop diameters, and some appear to be true korts. Since kort
nozzles are hard to make, ID'ing one that's a good match would be really
useful. While looking at scooters, I noticed some have variable pitch props. By
variable I mean adjustable with tools, not adjustable underway. That could
prove a big performance booster for our application.</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;"> </span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">In
summary, I'd encourage a focus on the prop and nozzle, as I've found the
standard seals and reverse to be perfectly satisfactory. My trolling motors
leaked for the first time in 2012, after 12 years of use. I've left the oil in
them for years at a time. When I finally serviced them last year, there were
cheap rebuild kits readily available. </span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;"> </span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">Do
you need the measurements of the inside bits too? </span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">Best,</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><font size="3" color="black" face="Helvetica"><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Helvetica; color: black;">Alec</span></font></div>
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On Oct 27, 2013, at 8:29 AM, Joe Perkel <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:josephperkel@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:josephperkel@yahoo.com">josephperkel@yahoo.com</a>> wrote:</span></font></div>
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<div class="yiv8655329949MsoNormal"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;">All Psubber Alert.<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
A handful of members in conversation off list are coming to the conclusion
that perhaps a best solution to the thruster issues discussed, is to improve
on what has been demonstrated to already be viable. That is Minn Kotas as
demonstrated by Snoopy, Idabel, et al. Parts are readily available and
inexpensive. Case in point here,.. <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.northlandmarine.com/MinnKotaQuickRef.htm">http://www.northlandmarine.com/MinnKotaQuickRef.htm</a><br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Hank has graciously offered his efforts in modifying several he already has
on hand, and I am willing to put in many hours of CAD work to come up with
working drawings, with an eye on this armature in particular,.. <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.northlandmarine.com/MinnKotaArmatureAssy92-100-216.htm">http://www.northlandmarine.com/MinnKotaArmatureAssy92-100-216.htm</a><br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
The goal would be to add a mag coupling, Kort nozzle, and true reversibility
to a package that is compact, (4" dia) and field serviceable /
replaceable. The end product result would be open source to the PSUB
community.<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Immediate problem that needs a solution.<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
I need a lot of information and detail in order to proceed. Particularly what
I need is dimensioned section drawings of appropriately sized models.
Unfortunately, Minn Kota does not make this information readily available as
demonstrated here,... <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.minnkotamotors.com/service/ascs.aspx">http://www.minnkotamotors.com/service/ascs.aspx</a><br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
We need help accessing this information otherwise the effort is hobbled from
the start. If anyone can help in this regard it would help tremendously. <br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Joe<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Sent from Yahoo! Mail for iPad</span></font></div>
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