[PSUBS-MAILIST] Penetrator materials

Tue May 16 17:37:30 EDT 2017

Brian,
thanks, I have been looking at the 3M selection chart this morning.
http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_EU/EU-Marine/MarineSupplies/Solutions/BoatRepair/GeneralBoatRepairs/SealantAdhesiveGuide/
The 3M 5200 seems to tick all the boxes but I am not sure how flexible it is.
Looking at things on a microscopic level; the plastic insulation on the wires & the 
wiring jacket are going to compress at depth, & I want the glue to move with it
other wise the jacket or insulation may pull away from the glue. Also although I am
going to support the cable coming out of the light with a moulded jacket, their
may still be a bit of movement of the cable that could cause a breaking away from
a rigid glue or the breaking of the hardened glue.
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 17/05/2017, at 9:05 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,          That 3M 5300 is a pretty miserable adhesive, bullet proof stuff !    You even will get ur ear stuck to the phone ordering it !    It's used extensively on sailboats under the waterline.  The have fast cure and slow cure.
>  
> Brian
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Penetrator materials
> Date: Wed, 17 May 2017 08:49:24 +1200
> 
> Hank,
> thanks, I feel I am getting somewhere.
> I can't find Goop in N.Z. but have been looking at other marine products.
> You are right about the silicone not being ideal. 90 % of the marine adhesives
> I looked at are polyurethane based products.  Although the outer moulded
> section will be polyurethane, sometimes mouldable products lose a bit of their
> adhesion with their "bulking" additives.
> Keith Gordon gave me a link to a product he has used for splicing underwater
> cables. You squirt the glue in to heat shrink tubing that is around the cables, then
> heat the ends of the heat shrink tubing to close it. 
> I will do a bit more research on that today.
> Alan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 17/05/2017, at 12:11 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles ed <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
> Got it, there is a way better option than silicone for that.  The product is call Goop or shoe goo.  This stuff is amazing, it sticks much better than silicone and is super tough.  I patch my waders with it, and you can not peel it off, no way no how.
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Tuesday, May 16, 2017 4:25 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hank,
> I see you can't sleep again!
> Thanks for the offer on the windshield polyurethane. 
> My thought process went like this.... I had seen Doug's video where he
> had several failures using just the epoxy, so I was going to coat the epoxy
> with silicone to seal it better. On my Subconn connectors I noticed they
> have a thin layer of rubber vulcanised for about an inch up the wire casing;
> I wanted to mimic this but with silicone. Then the polyurethane outer was,
> as I have said, a cable support, protection for the silicone & to make it look
> tidy. It didn't necessarily have to adhere to the silicone. I need a material 
> that will compress at a similar rate as the cable I am
> using, so that one surface doesn't pull away from the other.
> I might test the silicone against the polyurathane to see what adheres best
> to my wiring & aluminium light housing, & go from there.
> I will have at least 50 through hull fittings to do & am open to playing around
> with a few variations to get it right.
> Cheers Alan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 16/05/2017, at 9:38 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
> There is really no need for the silicone layer, in fact it might cause you grief trying to get another material to stick to it.  If you need some testing done on the windshield stuff, let me know, I have some left over.
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Monday, May 15, 2017 7:10 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Thanks, I will have a look at that it sounds like it would have the
> adhesion that's needed.
> This stuff is designed for encapsulating electronics in marine
> environments. I was going to use it over a thin layer of silicone but
> might not use the silicone now. 
> Alan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 16/05/2017, at 12:06 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
> I have good luck with windshield adhesive (poly urethane)  I used it as a liquid rubber.  It is super tough and cheap.
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Monday, May 15, 2017 5:40 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Ended up ordering this encapsulating 2 part flexible polyurethane,  
> that is suitable for a marine environment.
> http://nz.element14.com/robnor/el110h-bk-250/encapsulant-2k-flex-pu-gp-marine/dp/1891122
> Will see how it goes!
> Alan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 16/05/2017, at 3:43 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Thanks Hank,
> I need the two wires to angle off to the sides as they are soldered on
> to the corners of the LED.
> Yes I could thread the outside of the nozzle & put on a blue globe cable gland,
> I have some. Even though Carsten & Emile are advocates of the Blue globe,
> they do fit two on each penetration; one on the outside, one on the inside &
> I can't do that with the light fitting.
>    I have come across a few likely candidates for the outer covering in the way
> of a mouldable polyurethane for marine applications......
> https://www.aeromarineproducts.com/product/urethane-75a-encapsulating-compound/
> This is an American product I can't locate here in N.Z.. Have found a local
> product ...
> http://www.electrolube.co.nz/products/encapsulation-resins-polyurethane/ur5118/polyurethane-potting-compound/
> Cheers Alan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 15/05/2017, at 11:59 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
> In an effort to keep it easy and clean looking, I would extend the penetrator body at the wet side to allow for  threading on a compression fitting.   Slide your cable into that and snug the nut and it is done and clean looking.   Also from my experience, I would not angle the wires, I would make it strait through and strip as much of the jacket as possible.  I am sure your drawing is not representing the actual amount to be stripped, but it should be more significant.  Keeping it strait will make it a lot easier, I have done over 20 wires in one penetrator with a strait threaded bore.  
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Sunday, May 14, 2017 9:40 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi,
> I have a number of penetrators to do on my lights & other items, & I'm
> looking for the best materials for them.
> My design is as below. It is the base of my light housing.
> I have stripped a small section of wire that runs through the epoxy.
> I am not sure of the best material on the next 2 layers.
> I am looking at this marine silicone, to seal about an inch up the wiring jacket.
> http://www.selleys.co.nz/car-care/sealants/marine/
> Am thinking I will apply this silicone with a brush & then tidy things up & both
> protect the silicone & support the cable with a molded rubberized outer layer.
> I am not sure of a suitable moldable material for a marine environment.
> Am guessing I will need about the same hardness as a standard o-ring.
> Any suggestions on the material or comments on the design thanks.
> Alan
> 
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