[PSUBS-MAILIST] scrubber filter

[Alan via Personal_Submersibles]

Thanks Cliff,
I have to go through all this.
Was thinking that the military document might be a bit old with advancements in
CO2 absorbent porosity etc. 
Here is a recent paper that talks about new standards for absorbent.
http://www.imca-int.com/media/225910/d1_david_cook.pdf
Alan
Sent from my iPad

> On 13/02/2017, at 8:43 AM, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Did some looking into published info on CO2 concentrations in submarines.   If you look at work by Hager 2003  for US NAVY, he looked at nine nuclear fast attack boats and the average CO2 concentration for the observed was 3,500 ppm with a range of 0-10,600 ppm.  In the same report  he looked at another 10 nuclear fast attack boats and the average of 4,100 ppm with a range of 300,-11,300 ppm was observed.  The reference for this work is:
> .
> Hagar, R. 2003. Submarine Atmosphere Control and Monitoring Brief for the COT Committee. Presentation at the First Meeting on Emergency and Continuous Exposure Guidance Levels for Selected Submarine Contaminants, January 23, 2003, Washington, DC.
> 
> In a report by Gude and Schaefer in 1969 from US Navy Submarine Medial Center they studied ten subjects after a 20 days of exposure on two patrols, they found their exposure was to 0.8-0.9% CO2 or 8,000-9,000 ppm.  The reference for this data is:
> 
> Gude, J.F. and Schafer, K.E. “The Effect of Respotory Dead space of prolonged exposure to a submarine enviornment.  U.S. Navy Submarfine Medical ,report SMRL587, 4.p June 27,1969.
> It is important to note that nuclear subs remove CO2 from their boats in an intirely different way, that use a small contacting vessel and Amine solution specifically monoethanolamine (MEA) that is recycled.  See http://www93.homepage.villanova.edu/michael.b.walsh/CO2Scrubber.htm   PSubs and rebreathers use a absorption method.
> 
> ABS rules require that we stay below 5000 ppm.  So to me as long as we can keep the CO2 levels below 5000 ppm for our boats we should be good.  
> With a radial filter and using SodaSorbHP 4-8 mesh, the scrubber on my boat keeps the level below 2200 ppm with the average about 1500 ppm.  
> 
> I may have mentioned this before (sad to get old) but there is an excellent report on CO2 scrubber design that Prepared by M. L. NUCKOLS, A. PURER, G. A. DEASON US Navy.    "NCSC TECH MAN 4110-1-83. I. (REVISION A). S00. TECHNICAL MANUAL tow. DESIGN GUIDELINES FOR. CARBON DIOXIDE SCRUBBERS. I. MAY 1983. 
> http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0ahUKEwi1ycq5jIvSAhULqFQKHZntCgEQFggcMAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fdtic.mil%2Fcgi-bin%2FGetTRDoc%3FAD%3DADA160181&usg=AFQjCNEkEuITHpiL3OhlPfSkacVD6iL3iA
> 
> There a lot of technical info on scrubbers in this report.  What we need is someone to take as a PSUB research project reading, digesting and converting this report into an Excel spreadsheet that we could use to evaluate our scrubber designs.  We could then do some experiment work with our scrubber's to test the new spreadsheet. 
> 
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> Cliff
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>> On Sat, Feb 11, 2017 at 6:13 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> Hank, I can't help but think that you should be doing better than 1500 - 1700. How fast is the airflow through your scrubber, where is the meter in relation to it, and does the cabin air get well circulated?
>> 
>> Sean
>> 
>> 
>>> On February 11, 2017 2:33:49 PM MST, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> Hi All,
>>> I did a scrubber test with my new 1kg radial scrubber.  It keeps Gamma at 1570 ppm to 1700 ppm it seems to fluctuate for some reason.  I am adding a discharge filter though because my absorbent was dusty. 
>>> Hank
>>> 
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>> 
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