[PSUBS-MAILIST] LED Lights
via Personal_Submersibles
personal_submersibles at psubs.org
Sat Jul 25 22:48:58 EDT 2015
Are you thinking about controlling the switching from inside the hull or just via a dip switch on the PWB?
Cliff
> On Jul 25, 2015, at 9:36 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> Cliff,
> I think we are getting confused with dimming & switching.
> I don't mind just switching between 10 & 5000 lm rather than dimming it down progressively.
> Like you I am wanting multiple lights; some out the side but at a lower power than 10,000 lm.
> However will concede to a single 10,000 lm light if that's what the majority wants.
> Have a 1000lm light pulled apart at the moment & the driver is miniscule.
> About 1/2" x 1/2" x 1/4''.
> Cheers Alan
>
>
> From: Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Sent: Sunday, July 26, 2015 2:01 PM
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED Lights
>
> Alan, I think the key deliverable is small inexpensive 10000 lumen light that we could DIY fabricate. I am thinking multiple lights per boat. I would like to be able to bring up a light screen on my HMI and toggle on and off individual lights. That would be the extent of the control. To me the real issue is as you note is how to dissipate 94W. This is three times the power of my 5000 lumen light. I like the idea of the circuit measuring temperature in the enclosure and rolling back the voltage protect the light as well as the other basic protections Ken has specified. This is going to be a small enclosure. As such the PWB is not going to have room for a lot of dual components. So to me we should revert back to no dimming.
>
> Cliff
>
> On Sat, Jul 25, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
> So Cliff,
> are you happy with the 10,000 & 5,000 switchable option, provided
> there are no more pins needed? I am happy with that. However
> if Ken can come up with thermal protection in the form of dimming
> I think that is a good safe guard. If you think of the heat from a 1 bar heater;
> we will be developing 1/10th of that in a small enclosure.
> Alan
>
> From: Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Sent: Sunday, July 26, 2015 1:29 PM
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED Lights
>
> Hank, I am with you on this. I think the dimmer overly complicates the lite. In the spirit of KISS and to keep the cost down, I am thing we need to roll back to the no dimmer position.
> Cliff
>
>
>
> On Saturday, July 25, 2015, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> I find that I either need light or not. I used to think dimming would be good, but now I would say it is a waste of time.
> Hank
> --------------------------------------------
> On Sat, 7/25/15, Ken Martindale via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED Lights
> To: "'Personal Submersibles General Discussion'" <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Received: Saturday, July 25, 2015, 5:53 PM
>
> #yiv7943653100
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> #yiv7943653100 These are standard reflectors made
> for the 29 LED array, they are not expensive but have not
> actually found the cost yet. They are made out of plastic but
> metal ones are also available. Have you a suggestion? Now’s the
> time to make changes. The beam angle of the array is 120
> degrees to 50% falloff which will be modified by passing
> through the proposed flat port. Don’t know by how much,
> haven’t looked at that problem. Take a look at the spec on the web
> forum. New release today from Cliff and I. Dimming seems to be the present
> issue, to dim or not to dim. Appreciate your
> comments, Ken From: Personal_Submersibles
> [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On
> Behalf Of Alan James via Personal_Submersibles
> Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2015 5:58 PM
> To: Personal Submersibles General
> Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
> Lights Ken, in your latest
> document you are stating....There are a number of reflectors
> made for this 29 LED Array with beam angles of 18, 28 and 40
> degreesLooking on my
> favourite underwater light site, I found the following beam
> angles...
>
> 3 with 85 degree
> flood, 1 with 85 & 32 spot option, 2 with 77 or 30, 2
> with 75 or 38 & 1 with 65 flood.It seems up round
> 80 degrees is the most popular.I like the idea of
> being able to interchange reflectors to have either a wide
> or narrow beam.To get the 80
> degree flood we would need to create a housing so that the
> emitter was near enough to the lense to be able to
> get that wide angle. With a reflector that was more narrow
> we could then reduce the angleto
> suit.There are miriads
> of reflectors on the Deal Extreme site (search on
> reflector). These are usually for flash lights& bike lights
> so not sure if we would get an 80 degree angle.Here is a bridgelux
> 80 degree reflector but about 3" diameter.http://darkoo.en.alibaba.com/product/60081774368-221072235/Bridgelux_COB_led_reflector_DK7560_REF_K_B_75mm_80_degree_white_reflector_high_efficiency_new_product.htmlI can do an
> extensive Google on this, but any thoughts on this direction
> first?AlanFrom: Alan James via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General
> Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>
> Sent: Sunday, July 26, 2015 9:17
> AM
> Subject:
> Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED Lights Cliff,the retaining ring
> for the lense could easily be made larger
> &have holes drilled
> for attachment, if people wanted to modify the design for
> there own purposes. Also
> noted on the D.S.P.&L. site that they have multiple
> options for differentbrands of
> connectors. Again just make the thread on our generic
> housing for whateverconnector or blue
> globe cable gland we want.Alan From: Cliff Redus via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General
> Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>
> Sent: Sunday, July 26, 2015 2:17
> AM
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
> Lights Alan, my thinking
> is that with the flange, you could mount the light either
> way. On the new boat I am designing, I am planning a FRP
> recess so that outside of the flange is flush with the
> outside of the FRP shell. Would still need to cut a hole
> were the body passes through the FRP shell. Yes this does
> reduce the convection heat transfer from the light but I was
> thinking of leaving say a 3/8 clearance around the recessed
> flange. I don't see any problem with either approach
> to sealing on a MPB by using a neoprene flat
> gadget.
> Cliff On Fri, Jul 24,
> 2015 at 3:58 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> wrote:
>
> Cliff,I was thinking of
> fitting the light in to a bowl
> shapedrecess in the
> fairing / ballast tank, whereas you were
> proposingcutting a hole out
> & fitting it in. In hindsight your idea is
> betterbecause my idea
> would inhibit the heat dispersion due to the
> fiberglasssurrounding the
> light fitting.Alan
> From: Cliff Redus via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General
> Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>
> Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2015 8:43
> AM
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
> Lights
> Alan, I am visual
> kind of guy. Can send me sketch of what you are describing
> and we can talk.
> Cliff
> On Fri, Jul 24,
> 2015 at 3:23 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> wrote: Looks a good solid
> light Cliff.On looking at the
> perpendicular cable entry, I was thinking
> weneed a back entry
> for the purposes of mounting in to a
> housingin the fairing as
> you have requested in your list.I am looking at
> mounting in to ballast tanks so will create the
> shape of the light in the
> molding to receive it. If there was a
> threadedextension on the
> back of the light it could slot through a hole & be
> securedwith a nut. This
> would make it easier to seal off the ballast tanks
> inmy
> situation.Alan
> From: Cliff Redus via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General
> Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>
> Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2015 1:55
> AM
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
> Lights
> Ken, if you go to
> Youtube and do a search on https://youtu.be/D7VnwODU7vk,
> or 5000 Lumen Bridgelux Vero 18 LED light, you will see a
> short video of the light.
> Cliff
> On Thu, Jul 23,
> 2015 at 3:29 PM, Ken Martindale via Personal_Submersibles
> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> wrote: Cliff, How do I look at
> them?? Ken From:
> Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
> On Behalf Of Clifford Redus via
> Personal_Submersibles
> Sent: Thursday,
> July 23, 2015 4:18 PM
> To: Personal
> Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
> Lights Now that Jon has
> the forum site set up for the LED light project, my
> suggestion is to move the discussion to the forum site
> called out in Jon's email. BTW, I have uploaded to the
> site the wiring diagram and housing drawings for the 5000
> Lumen light that was designed by the ME students I was
> mentoring last year. Cliff On Thu, Jul 23,
> 2015 at 2:55 PM, Ken Martindale via Personal_Submersibles
> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> wrote:Doing the dimming
> electrically is easy but the problem is the extra wiring and
> where do you mount the Potentiometer? We can include the
> wires in the cable for use as an option this also
> complicates the cabling. Instead of two wires we would
> require 4 wires. Personally I also
> like the dimming since it will extend the time you can use
> it out of the water. Anybody also like or dislike? Cliff
> would like to delete. You guys be sure to
> keep reading the spec. it will have almost daily updates for
> a while. Ken From:
> Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
> On Behalf Of Alan James via Personal_Submersibles
> Sent: Thursday, July 23, 2015 3:31 PM
> To: Personal Submersibles General
> Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
> Lights Cliff,
> Ken,I like the dimming
> option. The 10,000 lumens may be too much light
> insome low visibility
> conditions where there is a lot of back
> scatter.The 5,000 lumen
> option may act like a fog
> light.Also I am thinking
> of having lights mounted to the side which may
> notneed to be as
> intense.Depth rating....
> looking at the drawings of various 10,000 meter light
> housings,it seems simple to
> achieve a reasonable depth without much more
> cost.Potting the
> board..... I would be careful about what was potted in case
> some of thecomponents needed
> to get rid of a bit of
> heat.Mechanical
> housing..... with you on that one Cliff. Like the idea of
> the recessed light.Alan From: Clifford Redus via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General
> Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>
> Sent: Friday, July 24, 2015 4:06
> AM
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
> Lights Ken, good first
> pass at the specs. Below are comments. BTW, I will post
> these here as I have not been able to get the activation
> code back yet on registering at the
> forum. Item 2.1 DC
> Voltage. If it were me, I would stick with nominal battery
> bank voltages of 24 and 36 VDC. When I switch to MK 101
> thrusters, I dropped my main battery bank voltage to 36VDC
> my instrumentation bus is 24VDC. Would need a
> single fuse holder to accept fuses to handle different
> nominal voltages. Item 4.0 Depth
> Requirement. In the spirit of keeping cost down, I think
> 500 meters (1640 ft) would be more than enough. I know
> Scott is designing a deep diving boat but is any one else
> shooting for more than
> 500m? 6.0 Dimming. I
> would omit the ability to dim the light. Yes I know it is
> easy from an electrical point of view but it forces us to go
> with more pins on the subsea connector. I am thinking on
> installing multiple lighs so I could just control on/off
> for each light. I could go either way on this but in the
> spirit of KISS, I vote to omit
> dimming. 8.3 Ports I would
> change plastic to acrylic. I don't think we will end
> up here but if we do, we can use PVHO flat view port calcs
> to size the acrylic lens. 9.0 Printed Wiring
> Boards. I really like the way the Minn-Kota motor
> controller PWBs are potted. Rather than using the spray on
> hydrophobic coatings, to me we should pot the board (accept
> for access to fuse). Therefore suggest changing the word
> coated to potted. 11.0 Mechanical
> Housing. I suggest. The LED panel light and PCB shall
> be contained in a single 1-atm flange mounted
> cylindrical housing with a low profile that can be recessed
> in a FRP shell with attachment screws from the rear of the
> flange. The housing should contain a single 29 LED Array
> rated at 10,000 lumens with a rated power of 91-140
> lumens/W (109-71W). Mounting holes will be provided for
> an optional SS yoke style support bracket.
> Material: Hard
> anodized 6061-T6 or 7071-T6 TBD (I have a grey beard
> machinist friend that owns a machine shop. He loves
> 7071-T6 as it is a dream to machine and stronger than
> 6061-T6. On Thu, Jul 23,
> 2015 at 9:52 AM, Ken Martindale via Personal_Submersibles
> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> wrote: Cost is critical.
> The electronics should be a small part of the cost. The
> housing might be the most expensive. Hope you guys are
> reading the specification. Ken From:
> Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
> On Behalf Of Clifford Redus via
> Personal_Submersibles
> Sent: Thursday,
> July 23, 2015 10:18 AM
> To: Personal
> Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
> Lights Jon, thanks for
> setting up the forum. I am assuming we can post files as
> well. I agree low cost
> is important but having a functioning light is as well.
> OTS LED utility lights like that one you noted are not an
> option unless they can be potted. To me the best way to
> keep the cost low, is to publish construction drawings of a
> 1-atm DIY housing that a psubber could machine or have
> machined by a friend, and publish a design of a PCB that
> could be easily fabricated using one of the PCB online
> sites like ExperessPCB www.expresspcb.com and
> DIY populate the board. As a group, we design and build a
> prototype that I can test in my shop. If it works as
> designed, then we post to the psubs site a report, that
> includes the design drawings, circuit diagram, parts list
> and test
> results. Getting a
> consciences on the design spec is the first
> step. Cliff On Wed, Jul 22,
> 2015 at 10:11 PM, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles
> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> wrote:
> My
> three words of advice...cost, cost, cost.
>
> One measure of a success for
> this project will be how many people actually build/use
> it. If it costs more to manufacture than just purchasing
> something like http://www.surpluscenter.com/Electrical/Lights/DC-Mobile-Equipment-Lights/12-24-VDC-3120-LUMEN-16-LED-UTILITY-FLOOD-LIGHT-12-999-B.axd
> off the shelf then it's real world application by
> psubbers may be limited.
>
> Over-spec'ing the design above requirements
> for typical recreational operations (ie 10,000 psi
> capability) is likely going to drive up the cost. Also,
> let's remember that "cheap", "low
> cost", and "good price" are relative terms
> for a diverse group like PSUBS so include realistic
> estimates of parts and manufacturing especially if tooling
> is required.
>
> Jon
>
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