[PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator arm

Mon Jun 2 17:35:44 EDT 2014

Ok. I have a feeling I will go through many revisions. Did Perry ever build their own manipulators or were they always outsourced?
Thanks,
Scott Waters

Sent from my U.S. Cellular© Smartphonevia Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:Scott,

I think it will be simpler than that, even.  All done by valves in the pneumatic version. Purely mechanical and air. Then an upgrade could be made to hydraulics with the same system if someone wanted. I should have some drawings for you by Bellingham. Maybe sooner if I can find my pencils.

Vance

-----Original Message-----
From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Mon, Jun 2, 2014 5:21 pm
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator arm

Scott,
You may have an opportunity here.  You can offer an arm in pneumatic or hydraulic.  The arm will be exactly the same, just install hyd valves instead of air valves.  Brilliant!  Even the same wiring harness will work.  More brilliant!   :-)
Hank

On Monday, June 2, 2014 4:43:35 PM, via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Scott,

I don't, as it happens, but I could do a sketch. Meanwhile, I'll inquire about the possibility of doing a little cloning project on the real thing.

Vance

-----Original Message-----
From: swaters via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Mon, Jun 2, 2014 2:15 pm
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator arm

Vance,
Do you have any pictures of it?
Thanks,
Scott Waters

Sent from my U.S. Cellular© Smartphone

via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
Scott,

Looking at Schilling, etc., is instructive, but rather like watching those shows on cable television where young couples are trying to decide whether to buy a five hundred and eighty-five thousand dollar house or a six hundred and twenty-nine thousand dollar house, neither of which they can afford.

What we really need (in my opinion) is something simpler. Think mobile gripper to start with. I know of a lightweight three-function pneumatic arm (shoulder left-right/up-down and gripper) that worked fine. It was designed to be easy on the pocketbook and simple to use/maintain. Valves, tubing, three pistons, some smallish diameter aluminum pipe, and a few brackets to build. Not a bad place to start.

Vance 

-----Original Message-----
From: swaters via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Mon, Jun 2, 2014 9:26 am
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator arm

Thanks Alan!
-Scott Waters

Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
Scott,
here is a link to the Schilling manipulator manuals.
www.fmctechnologies.com/en/SchillingRobotics/Technical-Manuals.aspx
Very scary. They are the rolls royce of manipulator.
Usually near the end of these 500 page pdfs there
are various gripper drawings with measurements
that would be a good basis for gripper design.
Alan

Sent from my iPad

On 2/06/2014, at 11:37 am, swaters via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Thanks for the info Vance. I am starting to get a idea of some direction for a psubs manipulator.
Thanks,
Scott Waters

Vance Bradley via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
Hytorc makes a good line of robust, self-contained continuous duty pumps, most adjustable from 1500 to 10000 psi. The.120 volt units we used had a universal motor so could be run on straight off the main buss. We set them up with an accumulator pre- charged to 1000 psi and a pressure switch set 1000 to 1500 psi. This supplied pressure to a double bank (6 each) of Parker-Hannifen solenoids controlled with their own 12 volt tap. Twelve solenoids gave us control for two manipulators, plus rudder and dive planes (with some variance depending on the sub). All of this was mounted internally. Eventually, perry went to external compensated pump/solenoid boxes for the manipulators, but by then the subs were up in the one point five to three million dollar range. The resultant increased budget and their growing experience with work class ROVs made that practical. All the later boats were set up with the external package, as far as I know.
Vance
Sent from my iPhone

> On May 29, 2014, at 4:36 PM, Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hank,
> That seems like very good advice.  I am wanting to do a manipulator but need
> to get some idea of what lifting or forces are required.
> What are the pumps you have found to work best.  What pressure do they
> develop? I had no idea what a top pump was so googled it and came up with
> breast pumps!! I didn't want to make a tit of myself so chased down some
> more and found that they are for convertible cars. They look a bit on the
> large side diameter wise.  Any brand best?  Cheers,  Hugh 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
> On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
> Sent: Friday, 30 May 2014 12:21 a.m.
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator arm
> 
> Scott,
> No matter how you do it, a manipulator will cost some of money.  I have made
> many and the tendency seems to be, to try and make them strong to lift a
> lot.  Well first off, I think it was Vance that said it best.  A manipulator
> is for manipulating not lifting.  With that in mind, large components are
> not needed.  Simple air cylinders from ebay are  all that is needed.  A 2in
> bore and depending on manip design, 4in stroke, maybe as much as 6in stroke
> is all you need.  Keep the rod size small at 5/8, that reduces the back
> pressure.  I have said it before, I love convertible top pumps.  Consider
> using one pump per function again purchase from ebay for 125 bucks.  No need
> for valves, the pump simply runs in reverse to change direction of the
> piston. Keep the pumps inside the sub and it is real simple.  As for the arm
> itself, if have made them from cardboard first.  You can mock it up that way
> and find the best pin locations for the cylinders and ensure the  cylinders
> stroke properly without over centering. You can build the arm with square
> tubing, use 3 inch aluminum so the cylinders fit inside when the arm is
> folded up.  Forget about a wrist until you have lots of time to play around.
> Four functions will serve a psubber well and can be built for under 1,000
> dollars. I can send you a convertible top pump to play with if you like.
> Hank
> --------------------------------------------
> On Wed, 5/28/14, swaters via Personal_Submersibles
> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator arm
> To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org
> Received: Wednesday, May 28, 2014, 9:31 PM
> 
> Hey guys. I am
> still working on the manipulator arm project for the K  boats. I am a
> little overwhelmed as to what direction to  head. I really don't know where
> to start because of my  lack of knolwedge. Does anyone have any pointers as
> to where  to start? I am thinking about using electric motors rather  than
> hydrolics just because of the amount of external  operating
> peices. Thanks,Scott  Waters
> 
> 
> 
> Sent
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